MODESTY, Where Art Thou?
posted by ladylessons in Real Life Lady LessonsRecently on a horse forum of which I am part, there was an “off topic” thread that really caught my eye. One of the women on the board had recently gotten a new job and was very excited about it. But she had a big problem: she was trying to improve her wardrobe to go with this new, higher level position and was very frustrated in the process. The title of her thread? “Where can I get clothes that don’t make me look like a hootchie mama?”
She was serious. The skirts are hideously short and tight, the blouses are sheer and low or tight, the shoes tend to be those stilletto heels. It didn’t take her long to realize that finding modest but flattering clothing for someone in her 30’s was going to be tough.
I have a neighbor who has an 11 year old daughter and this year’s back-to-school was a nightmare. Not that the mother was having screaming fights with the daughter. Oh no. The daughter was in tears by the end of the shopping day because the t-shirts, blouses, pants, skirts and accessories available made her feel like she was working in a strip club. Some of the sayings on the t-shirts would have made those strippers blush. This mother and daughter are not alone in their frustration.
Thankfully, there is a Modesty Movement brewing. Google the words “Modesty” or “Modest Clothing” and you’ll see an increasing number of articles or websites dealing with this issue. And, the word is spreading. CNN reported in September, 2007, that modesty was making a return in the Fashion world. GOOD. It’s about time. So many women are sick unto death of the Britney Spears Method of Dressing: Hooker Style. Check out this article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/LIVING/homestyle/09/12/modesty.fashion.ap/index.html?eref=rss_showbiz
There was a time when mothers took daughters aside and explained WHY it was important to sit properly, wear clothing that was attractive but not overtly suggestive, to express themselves with intelligence and decorum and how to keep proper hygiene, hair care and the application of minimal make-up which would enhance but not overwhelm their features to the point of looking like a downtown hooker. Confidential conversations about “becoming a woman” had much more to do with these things than just the physical facts of life. Mothers would clearly explain to their daughters that boys would pressure them for sex, but that an intelligent and good girl would not “go all the way” as that was something meant for marriage. It was meant to be cherished. Girls were taught that they should VALUE their bodies and their “selves” and because they valued their bodies and selves, then their future husbands would value their bodies and selves as well. Girls were prepared to know how to dress, walk, talk, behave and present themselves to the world as a “pearl of great price” and a girl with a “good reputation”. No man worth his salt would marry a girl with a bad reputation! IF the girl chose to ignore this, if she was “fast” and lost her good reputation, it took either many years to repair it (if that was possible in her locale), or she would have to move to a new place and start over.
Is this kind of Modesty meaningful today? Many would say this is an old fashioned concept, that today’s “with it” young gals don’t need to worry about a social reputation, or worry about being Modest. They say you don’t do that in the business world. Women have their own rules now. They have college degrees, they work, they travel all over the world, they can do anything they want, sleep with anyone they want, be as rude or as nice as they want, so screw the old fashioned ideas. Right?
WRONG. I found that using my female Modesty in the professional and business world did not close doors, it OPENED doors. I maintain that ANY woman will benefit by understanding that how she comports herself raises or lowers her possibilities in life, both in romance and in her career (should she choose, or have to, work outside the home). This means that proper use of make-up, modest yet attractive clothing (for work, play or formal times), a sense of value in and of herself,an attitude of grace and respect for others and a limit on the foul language changes her options for the better. Men who are looking for someone to share their lives with, a trusted partner to help them make THEIR way in the world, are looking for a LADY, not a hooker. A Lady is an asset to the man’s career, of course, but where it really counts is at home.
A man wants and needs a real PARTNER. This means that she must understand that her abilities, skills and talents should mesh with his and vice versa. She is an equal partner, but not the SAME. She needs to understand that a couple are a TEAM, not just two individuals. If she wants to remain an individual, live solely for her own goals and for her own personal desires, then she should remain single.
The feminists have done their sisters wrong by putting forth a model of being a self-involved bitchy, mouthy, whiny woman who just is focused on “getting hers” as the “Equal Woman” model. No, these are not the models girls or women should aspire to. These are the models of females who either do not have the ability, the discipline or the character to move beyond and become what society sorely needs: Modest Ladies. A woman can be an educated, smart, talented and focused Smart Lady and still be a helpmate to her husband and a good mother to her children. Being a Modest Lady is NOT being a doormat! Her children will be happier as well. Think about it—which kind of atmosphere do you want your children to be raised in? In an atmosphere of edgy, bitchy, whiny, distracted, badly mannered and nasty tempered and trashy dressed surroundings? Or, one where the wife and mother has a sense of personal pride, accomplishment, manners, decorum and completely understands family teamwork?
If you have any question about that issue, just look at our current society. It’s in bad shape. How to fix it? It all begins with Modesty.
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Pink background on MABTW, what a blasphemy
I suppose I will get over it, however on to the disection of your blog.
I liked it, I honestly did. I think there’s a lot to be said for a woman that comports herself with dignity and poise, no matter what shes wearing. What I mean by that is that you can tell a graceful woman that respects herself, even if shes in pajamas. I am tired of the hypocrisy of a woman that dresses like a street walker, then expects to be treated like a princess. I told one last week that princesses don’t dress like that. Ahh well, so much for love at first sight hmmm?
Ladylessons said:
A man wants and needs a real PARTNER. This means that she must understand that her abilities, skills and talents should mesh with his and vice versa. She is an equal partner, but not the SAME. She needs to understand that a couple are a TEAM, not just two individuals. If she wants to remain an individual, live solely for her own goals and for her own personal desires, then she should remain single.
Ahh blessed ambrosia, I wish more women understood this. Men don’t want a COMPETITOR, they want a partner. I could care less how much a woman makes, or drives or does for a living (to a certain degree). They don’t want to argue about whos doing half of this or half of that. Many Men want SYNERGY in their lives. Someone that will work with them, not scheme, plot, manipulate and steal. Since a goodly majority of women have become this way, many Men refuse to commit to them. I won’t even get into the “laws” surrounding marriage and child custody at this time. This is why women try to shame Men into commitment, because many of them know deep down that they aren’t WORTH commiting to.
Does a woman have to look like a hooker to look good? Not in my view. As I get older I notice that a few women have this thing called “class” and “style”. It’s rapidly fading, however it still exists and thank god for that.
-Strength and Honor-
I agree.
It always amuses me when women go out to nightclubs with their bums hanging out their skirts and boobs spilling over their tops and then have the cheek to complain that men stare (YES STARE) at their bodies. I mean WTF?! If I were to walk around practically naked, I would be surprised if nobody looked at me. Why the hell do they dress like this anyway? Pfft.
Luka,
From a male perspective, they dress how they will, and I will afford them every right in that aspect. However what they refute for the most part is the CONSEQUENCES of their actions. This isn’t coming from an “old” Man either. This is why I refuse to respect women that have no respect for themselves.
Dress how you like, I do. But don’t expect me to look at you as anything other than what you present yourself as. I live the same. I am a dirty white Man. I am dirty because I am WORKING all of the time in a laborous job. The majority of my life is spent in work. I work to pay my bills. I work to pay my “child support”, I work to pay for everything in my life. So for the most part I “appear” to be “dirty” because much of my life is spent that way. I don’t expect women to view me as a King because of my choices, nor do I expect them to flock to me either. Its pretty pointless. However its funny how women will expect the complete opposite from you in that sense.
Pardon my drunken rant VL, I hope this makes some sort of sense.
-Strength and Honor-
abbadon_fff, your “drunken rant” makes perfect sense! NO worries! Thank you for your comments and insights.
Pink…hehe
I agree, very well written. I never get tired of reading the thoughts of a women that gets it. I would just like to add a short story that fits this subject.
I have talked with my son about how women dress that way for attention, then claim they don’t want the attention, and then try make you look like some pervert. He soon understood what I meant when we entered my bank one saturday afternoon.
The teller, a female with well above avg looks and breasts, gives me a HUGE smile and says she can help me over here. So my son and I walk to her window, and shes giving me this look, like we were at a bar or somthing. I am actually not bad looking. Her cleavage was so overdone, I was shocked actually. I of course avoided her cleavage, and her constant eyelash flashing behavior.
Well, it only took a moment for her frustration to appear. I could see her looking at my eyes as she did the transaction. She just kept looking at my face and getting more and more frustrated. It was very clear I was avoiding looking at her breats. At the end of the transaction, she put my cash and receipt on the counter without a single word, then looked at the tellers next to her as they were talking. I paused a moment, then grabbed my stuff and walked out, she never said a word.
When we got outside, my son looked at me with a huge smile and said “Now I know what you mean, she was pissed because you wouldn’t look at her tits”.
It was a good day
I know what you mean by a modesty movement…for a while I couldn’t find a skirt that was above my knees. That may be fine and dandy for some, but long skirts are HOT, and it gets HOT here.
As for make-up, I don’t wear any. Only on special occasions, and every now and then.
But, perhaps you’d like to change my mind on this matter, but, I don’t see the importance of me acting like a “lady”. I’m not even sure what you mean by that. If you mean being polite, well I got that covered. I’m always nice to people, I’m well behaved, I’ve one boyfriend, so I’m hardly promiscuous.
Hey, I really love this one- I’m already thinking of ways to talk to my daughter about this kind of thing- especially the things that the men here mentioned. My mother never talked to me about anything important- If I were not so shy, I would have gotten into some serious trouble when I were younger - most of my friends where turbo sluts. I don’t know how I wasn’t, but I wasn’t.
I know what you mean about the heat clair- It’s very hot where I live, so people often wear very small clothes- even men walk around in just short and sandals lots of times in the summer- everyone sweats and stinks, and you have to cake on the deodorant and shower three times a day or go swimming every day, unless you want to stay inside all summer. Everyone just walks around with drinks all the time.
As far as clothes, I just make sure no cleavage is ever showing, no matter what, no skin between my shirt and pants, and nothing to far above my knee, unless I’m camping in the heat- then, I wear whatever the hell I need to in order to stay cool. I usually don’t wear sleeveless shirts outside my house
It can be kind hard to find things that are modest that still look feminine and attractive, or don’t make you look like an frumpy old person- so when I find something good, I make a pattern out of it and make a few copies from different fabrics. I’m making a great thing right now- a dress with tight stretchy sleeves down to the elbows- a high, empire waist - about mid thigh, but not too loose- and slender pants that go under it. It is really modest, but flattering though.
Really, u monitor ur dress in order to be labled ‘modest’? well good for you i guess, that’ll give u something to do in ur spare time, that wont be easy.
Bare in mind tho, ‘modesty’ is subjective, so dont see something u like and think that “..oh..i cant wear that its turbo-slutish”. Just be you, sorry i know ur prob thinking…god teenager, but i cant help it.
i worry when i see/hear people saying how they’re modeling themselves to a fit a certain description of what they think people should would like…
hm, OH!! look, i dont agree with this blog, but u might like it. it sounds like ur sorta thinking.
http://ccostello.blogspot.com/
It’s usually jeans and a comfy t-shirt and my Nikes for me. I also like the sweat suites ( I know those are a little played out) but they are so comfy, plus my husband loves them on me. Don’t get me wrong I LOVE to dress up. My fav. dress up thing to wear is a really nice pair of jeans, heals, and a classy blouse or if it is hot I’ll layer some tank tops and dress it up with a necklace or a nice pair of earrings. But, for the most part I’m casual and comfy. Ever chase three rowdy boys in heals??? I can’t…..
tehe..nope. i only recently have become introduced to heels…only ever wore’em twice too. Give me flats any day. See what I mean by modesty being subjective though? What u described to me sounds fine, but that blog i linked 2, that girl thinks that jeans are immodest, and unfeminine. So she wont wear them.
I personally think jeans are very feminine and modest. It’s when you start wearing them two sizes to small and the crack of your hinie is showing, thats when I think it is immodest and just down right trashy.
I guess if you want to wear a nice dress everyday and it makes you happy then I dont have a problem with that. I just couldnt.
Number one, I’m very petite, only 5ft., and it is hard to find
dresses and skirts that look right on me. I almost have to shop in the little girl section just to find something to fit me, and I’m not going to do that. Number two, I think my husband would be really annoyed if I were to wear a dress or skirt every day. I mean come on, you CAN’T ride four wheelers in a dang dress. Or take the boys to boxing lessons in a dang dress. People would think I was nuts or something. It just wouldnt be practical for me….every day anyways.
naww…dont feel bad. u aint that small
im only 3 inches taller. 
i like dresses, i like jeans, i like mini skirts, i like knee length skirts, i like t shirts, v-necks, turtle necks, what ever i think looks pretty and im comfortable wearing at the time.
modesty is so subjective. to me, modesty is not in only the way u dress, but the way u behave, sure wear a mini skirt in my opinion, it can still be modest as long as ur not table dancing, or bush walking…or high rope climbing (sigh..i knew a girl that did that…).
each to there own tho.
Anyone with respect for themselves would know not to dance on table tops and climb a robe in a skirt. In my opinion, I dont think there are enough girls out there with respect for themselves, wether they dress modest or not.
Don’t ya just love being short. My seven year old son is catching up with me quick!
Oh yea, I also love Affliction, Sinful, Warrior Wear, Tapout, Ringside anything that supports UFC and boxing. My husband loves that stuff on me….it drives him crazy! He has great taste.
Hi Claire and Kebby,
I’ve been interested in what you’ve been saying about modesty here.
I hope that I didn’t give the impression that I felt the ONLY way to be “modest” was to wear a dress!
If you’ve read anything about me, you’ll know I’ve always been a VERY athletic and active person. Pants or jeans are what I wear MOST of the time…can’t ride a Hunter too easily in just a dress (old riding habits usually only had a “skirt cover by the way and “pants” under it). At any rate, please don’t think I’m just sitting around the house in a long skirt and sitting in a rocker being demure! HA! No way.
Kebby, I think you’ve said it best…modesty is a bit different for each woman because we ARE different and each have different styles and tastes. (Like you guys, I’m small, only 5′1″) and so I also have clothing issues. I can wear clothing which is activity appropriate, but I surely have a good sense of what is “slutty” and what isn’t. Flaunting and baring body parts in public isn’t modest. Wearing clothing which is alluring when I want to attract my guy is just sexy and that is fine! Just because a woman wants to be “modest” does NOT mean she cannot be sexy! But, it’s also Real Life out there, and I’m not going to climb mountains, ride horses to the hunt, work on the ranch or live every day of my life looking like Beaver Cleaver’s mother in a dress, high heels and pearls! Yikes, no!
VL,
Hi! I read your blog on modesty and you by no means gave me the impression you have to wear a dress to be modest. Clair had found a blog, http://ccostello.blogspot.com/ and that is what we were commenting on.
I hope I can gain the respect that June Cleaver had….just not in heals and pearls =).
I wear what I like. Mini skirt, v-neck, dress, pants, track suit, jeans, shirts…what ever. It all depends on where and what ur doing.
Each to there own though i reckon, if ur not hurting anybody, wheres the harm?
Hey Clair- I wouldn’t think anything about you one way or the other just because you are a teenager- You sound a lot smarter than a lot of “adults” I know- and I think 17 = woman, not kid.. I feel the same way you do - I think people should wear what they want. I don’t care if men or women show their bodies. I don’t like to do it though. - There are a lot of reasons why I don’t- one of them being that I find the differences in standards of dress for men and women strange- I was watching a political talk show tonight- four men, and one women- The woman had some of the most intelligent comments of the entire group- Compared to the men, though, she looked almost naked. She wasn’t wearing anything too unusual- she looked very classy. But the only thing you could pay attention to was her body- and I mean out of every thing on the whole screen - the other people, the furniture, what anyone was saying. She was beautiful, her makeup and clothes made her really stand out- and her arms and legs were showing- a very small bit of her breasts. She didn’t look skanky at all- but she did look very distracting, especially compared to the men - the only thing showign on any of them wear their hands and heads- not even their necks, really. I think when you show a lot of your body, its easy for people to write you off and ignore what you have to say. I don’t do that to women or men who dress ANY way- But I really feel like other people do it, especially men.
I think what needs to be better understood is that what you wear is a form of communication about you as a person.
If you dress like a business-woman, people will assume you are a business woman and treat you as such; dress like a slut and…you get the idea.
It is a free society and people will wear what they will, but most are completely unaware of how their clothes communicate to others.
I suspect all this talk about SHOULDS and MUSTs with respect to how a woman should dress goes over most people’s heads. Personally I don’t respond well to directivess as to what I should and shouldn’t wear. Perhaps the better approach would be to understand how the clothes we wear communicates to the world, and then allow people to govern themselves accordingly.
Anyway, those are my initial thoughts on this topic…
You’re right See. People do judge you according to what you wear..and to be honest I utilize that fact. I don’t dress how a girls supposed to. I hardly wear dresses, and skirts etc but rather jeans and a shirt.
You see, then they have nothing to look at, and you automatically filter out the people you want and dont want. Shallow people are driven away from you, but people with more of a soul stay for your personality. Then when I do dress up, people are shocked, then all those shallow people are all over you and its like “nuh uh Buddy”.
I Used to dress ONLY in baggy shirt and jeans for this reason, but now that I have the people I want, I dress how I like. They don’t even BOTHER about what your wearing, and its such a great feeling.
And thanks about the whole teen thing..tho i would understand if you did think less of me for it. I mean, my brain isn’t even finished growing so yeah.
@Clair
If I thought less of you because I’ve been alive longer, I’d be shallow.
See
I agree with this post… on one perspective, I converted to Islam so modesty is essential. Don’t get me wrong, there’s time where I enjoy looking good, but what I don’t understand is how a woman considers sexualizing herself for the attention of men to be “liberating” from men.
I go out at night sometimes, and see women at clubs dressed like… well… whores. There’s some girls I see at parties who literally put pieces of shiny tape over their nipples, and wear thong underwear under mini-skirts… How is this respectful? I’d be embarrassed to be near anyone wearing that.
I think covering up is important — you wouldn’t see a man walk around like that, and you wouldn’t wear those types of clothing to an executive type job… so why not treat it like Christmas? Your body is a surprise — if you leave it unwrapped for the entire world to see, it kind of wrecks the surprise.